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Melissa
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 Posted: Sun Oct 05, 2008 7:47 pm Post subject: Taking Sides: Should Obese Passengers Pay More? |
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http://boards.msn.com/Travelboards/thread.aspx?threadid=791963>1=41000
Planes are expected to be more crowded than ever this fall, so coach
passengers can’t expect to have very much elbow room. For most of its
history (and especially in the past few years), Southwest Airlines has
required passengers who can’t put down their armrests to pay for an
additional seat, to ensure (it says) that everyone has access to “safe and
comfortable transportation.” (The cost of the second seat can be refunded
if the flight is not oversold.) Should every airline follow suit? How
should carriers determine who’s obese? Take a side and make your argument!
Yes, obese passengers should pay extra:
With all the extra fees being piled on to fliers these days, it’s
surprising that an “overweight” fee has not yet been standardized. Not only
is this an issue of comfort for adjacent passengers, it’s also an economic
issue. As a recent Newsweek article pointed out, the more weight planes
have to carry, the more fuel it takes to fly. I don’t advocate having
passengers step on a scale at the check-in counter, but I think if people
can’t fit between their armrests then they should pay for the extra space
they take up. – Heidi
No, they shouldn’t pay extra:
Asking someone to pay an additional fee because of his shape or size feels
as discriminatory as charging more because of someone’s skin color or
ethnic background. Southwest says that fewer than one in 200 passengers are
affected by its policy, and that 98 percent of those charged for two seats
get a refund. So why embarrass someone who’s obese over an issue that
matters only once for every 10,000 travelers? If I’m stuck sitting next to
someone who’s unable to lower the armrests, I’m not likely to be thrilled
with the situation. But it’s just as likely the person sitting next to me
will be wearing heavy perfume, or snoring, or eating a smelly sandwich. Are
we going to ask those folks to pay extra, too? (Now, there’s an idea …) –
Jon |
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sanity
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Oct 05, 2008 7:47 pm Post subject: Re: Taking Sides: Should Obese Passengers Pay More? |
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"Melissa" <melissa@friendlyskies.com> wrote in message
news:20081005144732.B9A6A4E4AD@outpost.zedz.net...
| Quote: | http://boards.msn.com/Travelboards/thread.aspx?threadid=791963>1=41000
Planes are expected to be more crowded than ever this fall, so coach
passengers can't expect to have very much elbow room. For most of its
history (and especially in the past few years), Southwest Airlines has
required passengers who can't put down their armrests to pay for an
additional seat, to ensure (it says) that everyone has access to "safe and
comfortable transportation." (The cost of the second seat can be refunded
if the flight is not oversold.) Should every airline follow suit? How
should carriers determine who's obese? Take a side and make your argument!
Yes, obese passengers should pay extra:
With all the extra fees being piled on to fliers these days, it's
surprising that an "overweight" fee has not yet been standardized. Not
only
is this an issue of comfort for adjacent passengers, it's also an economic
issue. As a recent Newsweek article pointed out, the more weight planes
have to carry, the more fuel it takes to fly. I don't advocate having
passengers step on a scale at the check-in counter, but I think if people
can't fit between their armrests then they should pay for the extra space
they take up. - Heidi
No, they shouldn't pay extra:
Asking someone to pay an additional fee because of his shape or size feels
as discriminatory as charging more because of someone's skin color or
ethnic background. Southwest says that fewer than one in 200 passengers
are
affected by its policy, and that 98 percent of those charged for two seats
get a refund. So why embarrass someone who's obese over an issue that
matters only once for every 10,000 travelers? If I'm stuck sitting next to
someone who's unable to lower the armrests, I'm not likely to be thrilled
with the situation. But it's just as likely the person sitting next to me
will be wearing heavy perfume, or snoring, or eating a smelly sandwich.
Are
we going to ask those folks to pay extra, too? (Now, there's an idea .) -
Jon
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As long as they don't charge for 'stupid', they shouldn't charge for
'obese'. |
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sanity
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Oct 05, 2008 7:47 pm Post subject: Re: Taking Sides: Should Obese Passengers Pay More? |
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"Slim and fit" <never@msn.com> wrote in message
news:Xns9B2FFFD93167RIEC@85.214.90.236...
| Quote: | On 05 Oct 2008, Dave Smith <adavid.smith@sympatico.ca> posted some
news:48e93689$0$10385$9a6e19ea@news.newshosting.com:
Magda wrote:
On Sun, 05 Oct 2008 18:18:58 -0400, Marsha <mas@xeb.net> wrote:
... AllEmailDeletedImmediately wrote:
snip
If I buy a ticket on an airplane, I have implied rights, and not being
crowded out of my temporary personal space by a stinking inconsiderate
fatty is one of them.
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Just as an overweight person has implied rights not having to sit next to an
idiot. |
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Magda
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Oct 05, 2008 8:41 pm Post subject: Re: Taking Sides: Should Obese Passengers Pay More? |
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On 5 Oct 2008 14:47:30 -0000, in rec.travel.europe, melissa@friendlyskies.com (Melissa)
arranged some electrons, so they looked like this:
... http://boards.msn.com/Travelboards/thread.aspx?threadid=791963>1=41000
...
... Planes are expected to be more crowded than ever this fall, so coach
... passengers can’t expect to have very much elbow room. For most of its
... history (and especially in the past few years), Southwest Airlines has
... required passengers who can’t put down their armrests to pay for an
... additional seat, to ensure (it says) that everyone has access to “safe and
... comfortable transportation.” (The cost of the second seat can be refunded
... if the flight is not oversold.) Should every airline follow suit? How
... should carriers determine who’s obese? Take a side and make your argument!
...
... Yes, obese passengers should pay extra:
... With all the extra fees being piled on to fliers these days, it’s
... surprising that an “overweight” fee has not yet been standardized. Not only
... is this an issue of comfort for adjacent passengers, it’s also an economic
... issue. As a recent Newsweek article pointed out, the more weight planes
... have to carry, the more fuel it takes to fly. I don’t advocate having
... passengers step on a scale at the check-in counter, but I think if people
... can’t fit between their armrests then they should pay for the extra space
... they take up. – Heidi
...
... No, they shouldn’t pay extra:
... Asking someone to pay an additional fee because of his shape or size feels
... as discriminatory as charging more because of someone’s skin color or
... ethnic background. Southwest says that fewer than one in 200 passengers are
... affected by its policy, and that 98 percent of those charged for two seats
... get a refund. So why embarrass someone who’s obese over an issue that
... matters only once for every 10,000 travelers? If I’m stuck sitting next to
... someone who’s unable to lower the armrests, I’m not likely to be thrilled
... with the situation. But it’s just as likely the person sitting next to me
... will be wearing heavy perfume, or snoring, or eating a smelly sandwich. Are
... we going to ask those folks to pay extra, too? (Now, there’s an idea …) –
... Jon
"Steve" says:
It's not about the weight issue. It's not about how much the airlines have down-sized
their seats. Those are whole other issues.
it's about how everyone only having the right to use what they pay for. The price of
seats is set by the airlines and the size of the space is set. If we are unhappy about
the price of the size of the seats, then we can petition and have those changed equally
for everyone of all sizes, but if we agree on these terms, then we should abide by these
terms and use only what you have paid for. If one decides to use more than one space,
then pay for the additional.
It doesn't matter if one simply chooses to buy another space for comfort or one needs
another space due to his/her size. It's simply a matter of fairness. Being fat doesn't
give you the added rights and previlege of using what you didn't pay for or using what
others' have paid for.
If my yard isn't big enough to park my RV, do I get to park it on my neighbor's property?
If my storage space is too small to hold all my belongings, do I get to break into the
next storage space or just get another storage space for free and use it to store my junk?
It isn't discrimination about size. It's just about you only have the right to what you
paid for. If you want more, then pay for it, no matter how big or little you are.
=====
It sounds much better in French, but then, everything does. |
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Mike O'Sullivan
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Oct 05, 2008 10:33 pm Post subject: Re: Taking Sides: Should Obese Passengers Pay More? |
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sanity wrote:
| Quote: |
As long as they don't charge for 'stupid', they shouldn't charge for
'obese'.
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What counts as obese in the US anyway, considering that the average is
rising inexorably? |
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Patrick Paris
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Oct 05, 2008 10:45 pm Post subject: Re: Taking Sides: Should Obese Passengers Pay More? |
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On 05 Oct 2008, "John A. Weeks III" <john@johnweeks.com> posted some
news:john-1E8EAE.16282705102008@comcast.dca.giganews.com:
| Quote: | In article <p6aGk.888$yI6.488@nwrddc01.gnilink.net>,
"AllEmailDeletedImmediately" <derjda@hotmail.com> wrote:
people should pay for the space they occupy. if they need more than
one seat,
for whatever reason, they should pay for it. sw has a good policy;
it refunds if
the seat isn't needed. if you flow over your seat or into the aisle
(that includes
your arms, not just your torso), you should buy 2 seats, and you
shouldn't have
to be told to do so. it's just common courtesy.
BS. Seats should be made big enough that a vast majority of
Americans can fit in them. Southwest knows that people have
been getting bigger over the years. The average foot size is
almost twice as big since 1900, and the average Japanese kid
is nearly a foot taller compared with 100 years ago. Yet at
the same time, airlines are making seats smaller and smaller
trying to jam more people into already crowded airliners.
The seats should fit the people that they are marketing to.
It is just common courtesy.
-john-
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The vast majority of people can fit in those seats and they don't spread 6
inches on either side like the fatties do. The people who pay for those
seats are entitled to the space they pay for and they shouldn't have to
share their purchase with fatty overlap. |
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Alfred Molon
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Oct 05, 2008 10:53 pm Post subject: Re: Taking Sides: Should Obese Passengers Pay More? |
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In article <20081005144732.B9A6A4E4AD@outpost.zedz.net>, Melissa says...
| Quote: | Southwest says that fewer than one in 200 passengers are
affected by its policy,
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Aren't way more than 0.5% of Americans obese?
--
Alfred Molon
http://www.molon.de - Photos of Asia, Africa and Europe |
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Alfred Molon
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Oct 05, 2008 10:56 pm Post subject: Re: Taking Sides: Should Obese Passengers Pay More? |
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In article <GL5Gk.44613$Ep1.23434@bignews2.bellsouth.net>, sanity
says...
| Quote: |
As long as they don't charge for 'stupid', they shouldn't charge for
'obese'.
|
Then airlines should not charge for excess baggage.
--
Alfred Molon
http://www.molon.de - Photos of Asia, Africa and Europe |
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Markku Grönroos
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Oct 05, 2008 10:59 pm Post subject: Re: Taking Sides: Should Obese Passengers Pay More? |
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"Alfred Molon" <alfred_molon@yahoo.com> kirjoitti
viestissä:MPG.23531d9526d8234398be7e@news.supernews.com...
| Quote: | In article <20081005144732.B9A6A4E4AD@outpost.zedz.net>, Melissa says...
Southwest says that fewer than one in 200 passengers are
affected by its policy,
Aren't way more than 0.5% of Americans obese?
--
I guess 0.5% of them aren't dumplings. |
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John A. Weeks III
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Oct 05, 2008 11:10 pm Post subject: Re: Taking Sides: Should Obese Passengers Pay More? |
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In article <20081005144732.B9A6A4E4AD@outpost.zedz.net>,
melissa@friendlyskies.com (Melissa) wrote:
| Quote: | Yes, obese passengers should pay extra:
No, they shouldn’t pay extra:
|
It all depends on what you are paying for. If you are paying for
passage from point A to point B, such as on a bus or ship, then
it doesn't matter how big you are. The carrier is obligated to
take you.
If you are paying by the pound, such as going by US Mail or by
a common carrier truck, then each person should be weighed and
assigned a fee based on how big they are and what they carry on.
The method that Southwest uses, which is to single out people
based on being over some size limit, strikes me as being
discriminatory and highly offensive. But so far, it probably
is not illegal discrimination.
-john-
--
======================================================================
John A. Weeks III 612-720-2854 john@johnweeks.com
Newave Communications http://www.johnweeks.com
====================================================================== |
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Jim Davis
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Oct 05, 2008 11:15 pm Post subject: Re: Taking Sides: Should Obese Passengers Pay More? |
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"Alfred Molon" <alfred_molon@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.23531d9526d8234398be7e@news.supernews.com...
| Quote: | In article <20081005144732.B9A6A4E4AD@outpost.zedz.net>, Melissa says...
Southwest says that fewer than one in 200 passengers are
affected by its policy,
Aren't way more than 0.5% of Americans obese?
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Probably are, but there are many countries that trail by only a % or two.
It's becoming a world wide problem. |
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Magda
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Oct 05, 2008 11:30 pm Post subject: Re: Re: Taking Sides: Should Obese Passengers Pay More? |
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On Sun, 05 Oct 2008 13:10:53 -0500, "John A. Weeks III" <john@johnweeks.com>
wrote:
... In article <20081005144732.B9A6A4E4AD@outpost.zedz.net>,
... melissa@friendlyskies.com (Melissa) wrote:
...
... > Yes, obese passengers should pay extra:
... > No, they shouldn’t pay extra:
...
... It all depends on what you are paying for. If you are paying for
... passage from point A to point B, such as on a bus or ship, then
... it doesn't matter how big you are. The carrier is obligated to
... take you.
...
... If you are paying by the pound, such as going by US Mail or by
... a common carrier truck, then each person should be weighed and
... assigned a fee based on how big they are and what they carry on.
...
... The method that Southwest uses, which is to single out people
... based on being over some size limit,
They shoot them?
strikes me as being
... discriminatory and highly offensive. But so far, it probably
... is not illegal discrimination.
...
... -john- |
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Runge13
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Oct 05, 2008 11:58 pm Post subject: Re: Taking Sides: Should Obese Passengers Pay More? |
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Again that stupid subject, tailor made for north americans like greg morrow.
Crosspost of course.
"Melissa" <melissa@friendlyskies.com> a écrit dans le message de
news:20081005144732.B9A6A4E4AD@outpost.zedz.net...
| Quote: | http://boards.msn.com/Travelboards/thread.aspx?threadid=791963>1=41000
Planes are expected to be more crowded than ever this fall, so coach
passengers can't expect to have very much elbow room. For most of its
history (and especially in the past few years), Southwest Airlines has
required passengers who can't put down their armrests to pay for an
additional seat, to ensure (it says) that everyone has access to "safe and
comfortable transportation." (The cost of the second seat can be refunded
if the flight is not oversold.) Should every airline follow suit? How
should carriers determine who's obese? Take a side and make your argument!
Yes, obese passengers should pay extra:
With all the extra fees being piled on to fliers these days, it's
surprising that an "overweight" fee has not yet been standardized. Not
only
is this an issue of comfort for adjacent passengers, it's also an economic
issue. As a recent Newsweek article pointed out, the more weight planes
have to carry, the more fuel it takes to fly. I don't advocate having
passengers step on a scale at the check-in counter, but I think if people
can't fit between their armrests then they should pay for the extra space
they take up. - Heidi
No, they shouldn't pay extra:
Asking someone to pay an additional fee because of his shape or size feels
as discriminatory as charging more because of someone's skin color or
ethnic background. Southwest says that fewer than one in 200 passengers
are
affected by its policy, and that 98 percent of those charged for two seats
get a refund. So why embarrass someone who's obese over an issue that
matters only once for every 10,000 travelers? If I'm stuck sitting next to
someone who's unable to lower the armrests, I'm not likely to be thrilled
with the situation. But it's just as likely the person sitting next to me
will be wearing heavy perfume, or snoring, or eating a smelly sandwich.
Are
we going to ask those folks to pay extra, too? (Now, there's an idea .) -
Jon
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Rod Speed
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Oct 06, 2008 12:35 am Post subject: Re: Taking Sides: Should Obese Passengers Pay More? |
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Alfred Molon <alfred_molon@yahoo.com> wrote:
| Quote: | Melissa says...
Southwest says that fewer than one in 200 passengers are affected by its policy,
Aren't way more than 0.5% of Americans obese?
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Yes, but not so obese that they cant get the armrests down. |
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Cyberiade.it Anonymous Re
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Oct 06, 2008 1:52 am Post subject: Re: Taking Sides: Should Obese Passengers Pay More? |
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In article <6ksj8fF9ja1kU1@mid.individual.net>
"Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:
| Quote: |
Alfred Molon <alfred_molon@yahoo.com> wrote:
Melissa says...
Southwest says that fewer than one in 200 passengers are affected by its policy,
Aren't way more than 0.5% of Americans obese?
Yes, but not so obese that they cant get the armrests down.
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And that's if they sit in two seats. |
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